- Tei-council - lists.tei-c.org

TEI Simple vs TEI Minimal
by Martin Holmes 31 Aug '15

31 Aug '15

If you click on File / New in Oxygen, and look at the TEI P5 options, you'll see a bunch of templates called: Minimal Minimal with Internationalization Minimal with Math and so on. I believe that having TEI Simple alongside TEI Minimal (not to mention TEI Lite and TEI Tite as well) is going to be mighty confusing. I suggest that before we integrate Simple into this ecosystem we might want to reconsider whether we want these Minimal schemas or not. Cheers, Martin

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Agenda and Hangout info
by Hugh Cayless 31 Aug '15

31 Aug '15

Agenda is here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/16XMTZsjq09GnwBRiLCpzXbXTyd5R9dAVhKS3ZH2… The Google Hangout link is in the agenda. Do feel free to add items!

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let me share my pain
by Lou Burnard 30 Aug '15

30 Aug '15

You may be wondering how Pure ODD is progressing... Well, all over the place, there are bits of content model like this (expressed in pure ODD) <sequence minOccurs="0" maxOccurs="unbounded"> <classRef key="model.divBottomPart" /> <classRef key="model.global" minOccurs="0" maxOccurs="unbounded"/> </sequence> i.e. there may be nothing here at all, or there may be at least one member of the model.divBottomPart class possibly followed by some model.globals. This makes perfect sense when transformed to RelaxNG or even in XSD, but the DTD fragment we get for it is: (%model.divBottomPart;,(%model.global;)*)* which is not syntactically correct in DTD language. It needs to be ((%model.divBottomPart;),(%model.global;)*)* Alas, using the current oddtodtd, those extra parens only appear if the bare class reference is inside either a sequence or an alternation. But we have a schematron rule that says (reasonably enough) that a <sequence> must have two or more children. (We don't see this problem in the impure ODD, of course, because RelaxNG doesn't mind <group>s containing just a single pattern) This is not an isolated problem, either.... it's a favourite trick in our content models. Having spent most of today on this, I am reluctantly coming to one of the following conclusions: a) we should just abandon DTDs b) I could write a dirty hack to detect these things and post process the DTDs c) we should quietly drop the schematron rule d) someone (not me) should rewrite odd to dtd either to deal with these things properly or (more radically) to expand all parameter entities e) there is another silver bullet somewhere but i am too stupid to see it Any opinions? Recommendations?

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constraintSpec
by Lou Burnard 30 Aug '15

30 Aug '15

The content model of <constraintSpec> is currently <rng:zeroOrMore> <rng:choice> <rng:ref name="model.glossLike"/> <rng:ref name="model.descLike"/> </rng:choice> </rng:zeroOrMore> <rng:optional> </rng:optional> or, in pure ODD, <alternate minOccurs="0" maxOccurs="unbounded"> <classRef key="model.glossLike"/> <classRef key="model.descLike"/> </alternate> <elementRef key="constraint" minOccurs="0"/> The fact that this gives rise to an invalid DTD content model (there needs to be a <rng:group> or <sequence> round te whole shebang) isn't really my question though. This is my question: What on earth is the point of a <constraintSpec> that doesn't contain a <constraint>? Or if the idea was to permit just documentation (but not a specification) for one, why isn't the model just <rng:zeroOrMore> <rng:choice> <rng:ref name="model.glossLike"/> <rng:ref name="model.descLike"/> <rng:ref name="constraint"/> </rng:choice> </rng:zeroOrMore> ? I think this is a corrigible error, and the <rng:optional>ity of <constraint> should be removed.

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Abstract Model Enforcement
by Hugh Cayless 30 Aug '15

30 Aug '15

In my own copy of the Guidelines, which I’ll probably switch to a branch in the main repo soon, I’ve been playing with the new app. crit. capabilities. As you probably remember, we decided that allowing larger structures inside <lem> and <rdg> made sense, as long as there wasn’t any violation of the abstract model (e.g. using <rdg> to put a inside a ). I’ve been experimenting with adding Schematron rules that enforce abstract model concepts, such as: "no inside or <ab>", "no <div> inside " etc. These are general rules, nothing to do with the critical apparatus changes per se, but they should help. The commit with the changes is https://github.com/hcayless/TEI-Guidelines/commit/66d11fab1be737c0f17ad4521… <https://github.com/hcayless/TEI-Guidelines/commit/66d11fab1be737c0f17ad4521…> and you can experiment by grabbing a copy of https://github.com/hcayless/TEI-Guidelines/blob/appcrit/AppCrit/examples/Pr… <https://github.com/hcayless/TEI-Guidelines/blob/appcrit/AppCrit/examples/Pr…> and trying to cheat by putting, say, inside a <rdg> inside an <l>. If you do this in Oxygen, it should fuss at you and identify the problem at the correct spot. There are changes to prose that still need to be made, and there are probably more Schematron rules we could add, but I think this is workable. Thoughts?

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gnuify-changelog.pl problem in Roma source may apply to P5
by Martin Holmes 30 Aug '15

30 Aug '15

Hi all, I did a quick bugfix for this ticket: <http://sourceforge.net/p/tei/bugs/724/> back in July, but I'm now dealing with the ramifications of getting it onto tei-c.org, and in the process, noticing that the project was moved from SF to GitHub without some key code changes being made to handle the changelog; I think the same issues will apply to P5, so I think we could use Roma as a good testcase for handling the change. When you run "make dist" or "make install" in the Roma source, one of the things that should happen is that the latest changes are added to the ChangeLog file. That's done by calling a PERL script called gnuify-changelog, which seems to be fairly widely used; but it is explicitly customized for the project and its contributors, all of whom are listed explicitly. What it does is to call svn log to get the latest commits, then converts them into a GNU-style changelog by substituting more detailed user info for user names. There are four problems with this: 1. gnuify-changelog.pl no longer exists in the Roma source, since it's been pulled out of the P5 tree. 2. We're now using git, not svn, so the log info is differently formatted. 3. The script requires a hard-coded list of contributors to be maintained. However, git log seems to be more friendly than svn log, in that it includes user name and email: --------------- $> git log -n 1 --name-status commit 18cc86ddcd79b409a9bfa406426fe4685c37fa8a Author: martindholmes <mholmes(a)uvic.ca> Date: Mon Jul 27 14:05:29 2015 -0700 Fix for http://sourceforge.net/p/tei/bugs/724/. I'm doing a string-replace which catches the specific bug reported (double quotes) in the title and author fields, but doesn't make any attempt to do more comprehensive escaping, since that would need a significant rewrite of large blocks of the code, I think. M VERSION M roma/romadom.php --------------- git log can also be massaged to output stuff in XML, by defining an XML format. So I'd like to suggest the following, to be piloted and tested with Roma, but then implemented for P5 (and any other projects which happen to be using gnuify-changelog.pl in our setup: Replace that call with an ant task which reads the existing XML log file (if it exists), calls git log to output anything subsequent to the last entry in XML, calls Saxon to XSLT it to whatever we want and insert it into the existing XML log file, then calls Saxon again to XSLT the now-updated XML log file into the GNU-preferred text format. Alternatively, if those of you who love PERL would like to simply update gnuify-changelog.pl so that it can use the git log output format, you're welcome to do that; it's a bit urgent because I don't think a build will work properly otherwise. Another option is to rely (for P5 builds) on having an svn checkout which can generate an svn log in the expected format, and using that; and then re-inserting gnuify-changelog.pl into the Roma tree, changing the Makefile to point to it, and doing other updates (adding and removing potential contributors) to both PERL files. I think the ant/XSLT solution is better in the long term, and removes one more PERL dependency, but I suspect I'm in a minority there. Cheers, Martin

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Next Telecon
by Hugh Cayless 28 Aug '15

28 Aug '15

Hi all, A reminder that the Doodle poll for our August telecon needs your input, if you haven't already filled it out: http://doodle.com/5ks6ma5f3fez838c Right now, August 31 looks like the best date. I expect the agenda will focus mainly on the migration and on the logistics of a Fall release. It would be really nice to be able to discuss some tickets too though! All the best, Hugh

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[GitHub] Your password has changed
by GitHub 24 Aug '15

24 Aug '15

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[GitHub] Your password has changed
by GitHub 24 Aug '15

24 Aug '15

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[GitHub] Please reset your password
by GitHub 24 Aug '15

24 Aug '15

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Re: [tei-council] [TEI-L] <relation> w/in <placeList>
by Syd Bauman 21 Aug '15

21 Aug '15

Re: discussion Gabby & Martin are having on TEI-L I think this is evidence in support for a linked data block element that is a child of <text> but not in <front>, <body>, or <back> that is specifically for this kind of stuff (<relation>s).

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[GitHub] Please verify your email address.
by GitHub 21 Aug '15

21 Aug '15

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Validating Specs
by James Cummings 21 Aug '15

21 Aug '15

Hiya, I'm starting to look at creating individual spec files for the processing model documentation additions to the Guidelines and when I loaded up some random spec files (e.g. in SF svn: P5/Source/Specs/affiliation.xml) to use as a model I notice it didn't validate. We added an xml-model of: <?xml-model href="http://tei.it.ox.ac.uk/jenkins/job/TEIP5/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/relea…" type="application/xml" schematypens="http://purl.oclc.org/dsdl/nvdl/ns/structure/1.0"?> to these some time back. (And part of me wants to point out that maybe this should be http://bits.nsms.ox.ac.uk:8080/ or we should set up jenkins really to run on tei.it rather than use some URL rewrites...) However, the error message I'm getting in oXygen is: "Attribute @xsl:dummy-for-xmlns is not allowed on element <xsl:stylesheet>" I can't find where this is being caused. It doesn't seem to be in our p5odds.rng or p5odds.isosch files. Any suggestions? -James -- Dr James Cummings, James.Cummings(a)it.ox.ac.uk Academic IT Services, University of Oxford

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SVN Users
by Hugh Cayless 20 Aug '15

20 Aug '15

Looks like we can achieve a happier SVN to Git conversion if we supply Git with a mapping between SourceForge usernames and proper names + email addresses in the form hcayless = Hugh Cayless <philomousos(a)gmail.com> I’ve started a spreadsheet with usernames who’ve committed to our repo at https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1N8hIBphezGsNB0SvEx7wSamyshNrszeNrlm… <https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1N8hIBphezGsNB0SvEx7wSamyshNrszeNrlm…> Can you all please pitch in to help fill it out? Thanks, Hugh

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Fwd: Re: editing the TEI stylesheets
by James Cummings 19 Aug '15

19 Aug '15

Forwarding this reminder to tei-council to remind them that they need to keep a watching eye on such pull requests. (Once set up, we should get notifications sent to tei-council if possible) -James -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: Re: editing the TEI stylesheets Date: Wed, 19 Aug 2015 09:43:31 +1200 From: Stuart A. Yeates <syeates(a)gmail.com> To: James.Cummings(a)it.ox.ac.uk <James.Cummings(a)it.ox.ac.uk> CC: Sebastian Rahtz <sebastian.rahtz(a)it.ox.ac.uk> OK, so I sent a pull request almost a week ago https://github.com/TEIC/Stylesheets/pull/114 Do I need to notify someone? Or has feedback gone somewhere I'm missing... cheers stuart -- ...let us be heard from red core to black sky On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 10:01 PM, James Cummings <James.Cummings(a)it.ox.ac.uk <mailto:James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk>> wrote: Hi Stuart, The TEI Technical Council is currently reviewing how it uses GitHub as part of examining whether it is a suitable replacement for SourceForge in moving Guidelines development there. As you know, it moved the Stylesheets (and other software) building there some time ago. Although you (and various others) are members of the Stylesheets repository I believe the correct github etiquette is to fork, then issue a pull request. However, I think as long as you are flagging that you are making the change (or open an issue and then make the change as a result of that) it should probably be fine. (Though when you say 'regularise the display of attribute values' I'd be interested to know what you mean by regularise. There are some options and logic already in there.) The change in your forked version won't get looked at by Jenkins. We're also looking at whether some of the GitHub hosted alternative continuous integration systems might replace Jenkins. So, to be honest, you could do either, but fork+change+pull-request will ensure that it gets other eyes on it before going into the system. Jenkins uses the most up-to-date stylesheets when next building the Guidelines. I know it used to email when doing commits to the Guidelines SF SVN repository that broke something (or more accurately when someone committing around the same time as you broke something ;-) ) and I'm assuming that is still the case. I don't think it emailed just when it was running a job based on your commits...just when that job failed and your commit was one of those possible causes. That is my understanding at least, some of our council github gurus may correct me. -James On 12/08/15 10:26, Stuart A. Yeates wrote: I've got a change I'd like to make to the stylesheets used to generate the HTML version of the standard (a minor change to regularise the display of attribute values), but I'm not quite sure how to go about it. Do I just push a change request to https://github.com/TEIC/Stylesheets ? Or fork it? Does that get tested by jenkins? Jenkins used to send me emails when it ran a job based on my commits, but I've not seen one for a couple of recent commits, is that because I'm not on the council any more? cheers stuart -- ...let us be heard from red core to black sky -- Dr James Cummings, James.Cummings(a)it.ox.ac.uk <mailto:James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk> Academic IT Services, University of Oxford -- Dr James Cummings, Academic IT Services, University of Oxford TEI Consultations: tei(a)it.ox.ac.uk

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Validation errors in the Guidelines HTML output
by Martin Holmes 14 Aug '15

14 Aug '15

Hi all, I just discovered the VNU HTML validator, and I'm using it on another project; just for fun I ran it on a clean Guidelines build, and there seem to be about 150 errors, mostly minor and easily fixable. But it caused me to wonder why our build process didn't catch them, and I'm going to look into that. Validating modern HTML is notoriously difficult, but we should do the best we can, I think. Cheers, Martin

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langUsage content model
by Lou Burnard 10 Aug '15

10 Aug '15

The process of TEI content models proceeds apace and (as might be expected) is turning up a few oddities in some unfrequented corners. For example, the content model of <langUsage> is currently (in the source) <content> <oneOrMore xmlns="http://relaxng.org/ns/structure/1.0"> <choice>  <ref name="language"/> </choice> </oneOrMore> </content> Now, this is clearly nonsense : you can't have an alternation with just one option. But did we really want to remove the possibility for having a purely documentary <langUsage> such as Contains various unrecognised Polynesian languages? Can anyone remember why we made this change ? I would have expected to see something like <choice> <oneOrMore> <rng:ref name="model.pLike"/> </oneOrMore> <oneOrMore> <rng:ref name="language"/> </oneOrMore> myself.

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pure odd update
by Lou Burnard 10 Aug '15

10 Aug '15

I've now managed to get the P5-Pure branch of the P5 source up to date with the rest of the world, and have successfully run the P5 test suite (almost) to completion. *It would be very helpful if someone else could check this branch out and confirm that it works for them too!* The main difference is that all datatypes are now expressed using the new dataSpec and dataRef elements we discussed approx 3 million years ago. This in turn means that the old data.foo macroSpecs are now redundant, (we now use dataSpecs called teidata.foo). I have however left the old macroSpecs in the build, since their absence obviously causes existing ODDs that reference them to fall over. It's a pain however, and I would really like to get data.foo deprecated as soon as possible. Only a few (like 2 ore 3) of our test ODDs actually refer to them, but I've no way of telling how many ODDs out there in the wild do, nor how upsetting their maintainers would find it to be told to turn <rng:ref name="data.foo"/> into <dataRef key="teidata.foo"/> passim et seriatim (If you're wondering, the "(almost)" above means that my poor little laptop gave up trying to compile the massive tei_allPlus.odd.processed into tei_allPlus.rng ... probably the heat.)

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more daft alternates
by Lou Burnard 10 Aug '15

10 Aug '15

Something similar occurs in <fvLib> which currently has a model <zeroOrMore xmlns="http://relaxng.org/ns/structure/1.0"> <choice> <ref name="model.featureVal"/> </choice> </zeroOrMore> and in <classes> which currently is <choice xmlns="http://relaxng.org/ns/structure/1.0"> <zeroOrMore> <ref name="memberOf"/> </zeroOrMore> </choice> I'm regarding both of these as corrigible errors in the main P5 source and correcting them. But would appreciate feedback on the <langUsage> case.

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default vals and mandatory attributes
by Lou Burnard 07 Aug '15

07 Aug '15

Just for a change, here's a technical query. The TEI Enrich ODD (part of the Exemplars suite) is riddled with things like this: <attList> <attDef ident="columns" mode="change" usage="req"> <defaultVal>1</defaultVal> </attDef> </attList> which are now generating error messages from Schematron like this E [ISO Schematron] It does not make sense to make "1" the default value of @columns, because that attribute is required. Well, Mr Smartypants Schematron, it may not make sense to you, but it did to the folks who defined this ODD, and making their ODD invalid is not going to win you any friends. Could we at least change this to a warning, so that the P5 test suite can run to completion?

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Council's Future
by Hugh Cayless 06 Aug '15

06 Aug '15

As I hinted a couple of emails ago, I'd like to think about new models for how Council might work, with the following things in mind: 1. There is a push underway to improve the gender balance of the Council membership, which I'm fully in favor of, but which means we have a largish list of nominees and therefore the potential for a largish influx of new members in January, and possibly again the following year. My sense is that we could still be better at on-boarding new members. 2. I feel like having Council be purely an elected body carries with it both risks and rewards. The reward is clearly the periodic influx of new ideas and perspectives. The risk is that we lose expertise and continuity when Council members rotate off—and sometimes they rotate off for reasons like they forgot to submit a statement, or didn't read their email. We don't do a very good job of continuing to involve interested contributors after they've left. We say that new members don't have to be super-technical, and that's true, but there *are* wizard-level technical and conceptual components to the TEI and we need to have people who can manage them. As an aside, I'd like to see a push for making it *much* easier to do things like build the Guidelines, but I think we have enough on our plate at the moment. So what could we do to mitigate the risks and amplify the rewards? I've mentioned in the past that I'd like to see, besides the elected body of Council members, a group of committers who serve in much the same way as Council members but are there because they've been appointed and are willing to contribute. Committers might be subscribed to the Council mailing list, participate (as available) on teleconferences, and come to F2F meetings (perhaps subject to budgeting). They would be identified as Committers by the TEI—i.e. they would be listed on the website and could put it on their CVs. There's some precedent for this, of course: we've drafted Lou in the past when he wasn't technically on Council. My point is that, while former Council members don't lose their commit privileges now, they do get removed from the Council list, and are not included in meetings anymore, nor are they recognized in any way, so they lose the incentive to continue to contribute, with the result that they stop. That's not to say that people can't just serve their time on Council and then move on to other things, but that valuable, interested contributors should have a means to continue their work and should be recognized for doing so. Does this sound in any way sensible? What should be the benefits of being a Committer? How would they be appointed? What role(s) would they play? Should they be former Council members, or could we draft anyone (provided they have the ability and desire to contribute of course)? What do you all think? Obviously this would involve some rule changes and I assume we'd have to involve the Board, etc...

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I've just test-migrated my CodeSharing project from SF to GH
by Martin Holmes 05 Aug '15

05 Aug '15

Hi all, especially Raff, our migration manager. I just migrated my project from SF to GitHub in the following steps: === 1. PREPARATION === Do a freeze (not a problem for my tiny project). Make sure you have complete backups and checkouts. Prepare a JSON file called users_sf2gh.json which consists of the equivalent user names from SF and GitHub, like this: { "martindholmes" : "martindholmes", "stadlerpeter" : "peterstadler" } (Obviously this needs a bit of research.) === 2. GETTING TICKETS ETC. OUT OF SF ========================== Do a full export of the SF project from here: https://sourceforge.net/p/[proj]/admin/export This is not instant; you'll get an email when it's complete and you can download it as a zip. That produced these files for me: admin.json discussion.json tickets.json wiki.json It doesn't include the code, of course. === MOVING CODE TO GITHUB ===================================== Go here: https://import.github.com/new/ and follow the instructions to import your code. This was quick for my tiny project, but would take a long time for the TEI codebase. The commit history is preserved correctly, as far as I can see. I provided the https URL for the SF repo: https://svn.code.sf.net/p/[proj] While that's going on, or after it's finished, you're offered the option to provide the list of SF/GitHub user equivalences you've already specified in the JSON file, through a web form (you'll use the JSON file itself later, when importing tickets). === MOVING TICKETS TO GITHUB ================================= I used this PERL script for this: https://github.com/cmungall/gosf2github Beware: there is a typo (occurring in two places) which omits a quotation mark in the example; I've added a patch and sent a pull request to fix it. There are several stages to this: 1. Set up an OAUTH token for the Git repo here: https://github.com/settings/tokens 2. Get a list of the project collaborators in JSON format from github like this: curl -H "Authorization: token YOURTOKEN" https://api.github.com/repos/[entity]/[project]/collaborators > [project]-collab.json 3. Run the PERL script, which pulls down each ticket from SF and pushes it up to GitHub -- this is my command line: perl gosf2github.pl -a martindholmes -u users_sf2gh.json -c codesharing-collab.json -r martindholmes/CodeSharing -s codesharing/tickets -t [MYTOKEN] tickets.json You can run it with the -k flag first to do a dry-run and see the curl statements that would be addressed to github without sending them. This successfully imported the two tickets I had created as a test, one open and one closed, with embedded XML code successfully preserved. Hope this helps. It's nice to be on vacation. There's time to actually do stuff. :-) Cheers, Martin

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Test GLs repo on GitHub
by Hugh Cayless 03 Aug '15

03 Aug '15

All, I've pushed up a copy of the my own synced git-svn copy of the Guidelines at https://github.com/TEIC/Guidelines-TEST. It's got issues and a wiki enabled, so we can try those out as we like. Commits to SF should be synced periodically by my server, but changes you push here will not automatically be sent back to SourceForge (so you can try it out, with the foreknowledge that they'll probably be deleted). Currently in-use branches have been copied, but I've not bothered to create the old ones (the history is there, but they're not visible as branches). I've also not bothered to create any tags. This may be something that has to be done manually, as git tags are not branches, unlike svn tags. I bet there's a script for it somewhere. If not, I don't think writing one would be hard. Request for everyone: can you try out cloning and messing with this? In particular I'd like to know what *doesn't* seem to work, and what the pain points are. All of them. We will obviously need to develop new tutorials/documentation for this, so I very much want to know what's confusing, up to and including "I don't even know where to start with this git thing". Please don't be shy or embarrassed—you will not be judged. This is a new thing to many of us and will be to new members of Council in the future. GUI clients for those who prefer them are available at https://windows.github.com and https://mac.github.com. I've zero experience with them, but they may be nicer to work with if you're less comfortable in the command line.

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Why are we using a pantor.com namespace?
by Martin Holmes 31 Jul '15

31 Jul '15

In Utilities/guidelines.xsl.model, I see this: xmlns:pantor="http://www.pantor.com/ns/local" and something similar in the following files: Query/simplify.xsl Utilities-1/colorsvg.xsl Utilities-1/divsplit.xsl Utilities-1/generate-label.xsl Utilities-1/guidelines-latex.xsl Utilities-1/guidelines-print.xsl Utilities~1/guidelines.xsl.model Utilities~1/odd2ebnf.xsl Utilities~1/odd2exodd.xsl Utilities~1/rng2ebnf.xsl Utilities~1/split.xsl Utilities/guidelines-print.xsl Sometimes it maps to the prefix "pantor" and sometimes to the prefix "local". pantor.com seems to be some kind of electronic stock trading platform: <http://www.pantor.com/> The Stylesheets repo contains a file called RngToRnc.xsl, which is an ancient stylesheet apparently dating back to 2002, last edited by Syd in 2010. But this does not appear to use the pantor: or local: prefixes, and neither prefix seems to be actually used anywhere. Does anyone have any recollection of what was going on here? If we're not using this namespace, it would be good to get rid of it, especially since it's usually rather confusingly mapped to the prefix "local". Cheers, Martin

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svn:keywords
by Peter Stadler 29 Jul '15

29 Jul '15

It just occurred to me that GitHub won’t support svn:keywords such as $Date$ or $Rev$. Humans will probably adjust themselves but I don’t know whether any software piece in our (some) processing pipeline relies on this information? Best Peter

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