October 2018 - Tei-council - lists.tei-c.org

Rep: TEI workshop at Assyriologists conference
by Vanessa Bigot-Juloux 23 Oct '18

23 Oct '18

Dear Martina, Dear colleagues, I had a look at the minutes and saw that Vanessa added an item to the agenda that I missed during the meeting, sorry for that! No worries--I have added it belatedly. Regarding TEI workshop proposal: We haven’t received a call of session yet, so it is just something I would like to suggest to the organizers of this International conference. I think it can be a good opportunity to introduce TEI to neophytes. A suggestion of TEI workshop for Assyriologists which needs to be improved of course: - Morning session, TEI intensive overview based from Assyriological data: * What is TEI? * How TEI can help Assyriologists to improve their research wether it’s for philology, paleography, anthropology or other archaeological purposes (including a practical example with a list of goals for a specific project in order to be used (later during the morning session) to look for the good <elements> and @attributes). * What must a TEI practitioner need to know (TEI, ODD, XPath, XSLT, CSS) and why? * Short pratical examples: TEI (teiCorpus), XPath, XSLT (via Oxygen + preview in a browser). * How to read/use the guidelines (1) (used simultaneously with the practical examples). - Afternoon session: * How to read/use the guidelines (2). * What software to use and where to find assistance regarding this software? * Overview of TEI community and how to use Github in order to ask assistance to TEI community. * First step (suggestion to TEI tech council) to neophyte: TEI online mentoring, who, why and how? As for the morning session, I suggest working on a few practical examples (very short) that participants will send prior to the workshop in order to allow them to have a better idea of how TEI can help them. In addition, on a handout: a list of univ. who propose TEI/Xpath/XSLT training and online course (i.e.: Marjorie and Elena online training). After the sessions, I suggest giving a short questionnaire in order to list the needs of Assyriologists and how we can improve our guidelines/assistance to them. What do you think? Of course it means I’ll need support for this intensive day—from my university (i.e. Peter Stokes if he’s available during summer time) or a TEI tech council colleague (in Europe?). In advance, thanks for your kind advices. Best, Vanessa Le 23 oct. 2018 à 00:07, Scholger, Martina (martina.scholger(a)uni-graz.at<mailto:martina.scholger@uni-graz.at>) <martina.scholger(a)uni-graz.at<mailto:martina.scholger@uni-graz.at>> a écrit : Dear Vanessa and all, I had a look at the minutes and saw that Vanessa added an item to the agenda that I missed during the meeting, sorry for that! It is about the TEI workshop for ancient Near Eastern (ANE) scholars during the international conference of Assyriologists in July (Paris) https://iaassyriology.com/past-rencontres/ Vanessa, is it something that we can discuss via email? Best wishes, Martina _______________________________________________ Tei-council mailing list Tei-council(a)lists.tei-c.org<mailto:Tei-council@lists.tei-c.org> http://lists.lists.tei-c.org/mailman/listinfo/tei-council

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TEI workshop at Assyriologists conference
by Scholger, Martina (martina.scholger＠uni-graz.at) 23 Oct '18

23 Oct '18

Dear Vanessa and all, I had a look at the minutes and saw that Vanessa added an item to the agenda that I missed during the meeting, sorry for that! It is about the TEI workshop for ancient Near Eastern (ANE) scholars during the international conference of Assyriologists in July (Paris) https://iaassyriology.com/past-rencontres/ Vanessa, is it something that we can discuss via email? Best wishes, Martina

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Scheduling Spring F2F
by Scholger, Martina (martina.scholger＠uni-graz.at) 22 Oct '18

22 Oct '18

Dear all, here is our doodle poll for scheduling the Spring F2F meeting: https://doodle.com/poll/yp3uucnqmmiqyc9v Our meeting is supposed to be three days. I hope we will find three days in a row, where everyone has time. Please vote! Best wishes, Martina

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call in 30 minutes
by Scholger, Martina (martina.scholger＠uni-graz.at) 22 Oct '18

22 Oct '18

Hi all, we start our call in 30 minutes. See the agenda: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1n_Zo-s-PQeMCKwJPmGYbs0F9CMD0VcQe4Vie_Yo… Hangouts: https://hangouts.google.com/hangouts/_/brown.edu/teicouncil Best, Martina

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open issues
by Scholger, Martina (martina.scholger＠uni-graz.at) 19 Oct '18

19 Oct '18

Dear all, I've put the issues that we skipped last time into the agenda for Monday. Maybe you'll have time to look at one or the other: * https://github.com/TEIC/TEI/issues/1795 - Language of Schematron messages where @role="nonfatal" and @role="warning" * Related: Issue with merging https://github.com/TEIC/TEI/issues/1621 into dev branch--apparently something breaks the Jenkins build--investigating. * https://github.com/TEIC/TEI/issues/1707 : EB: quick update on measurement: Naoki's new sample code based on Tokyo decisions. * https://github.com/TEIC/TEI/issues/1805 - Suggestion for new uniHan element * https://github.com/TEIC/TEI/issues/1756 - event should have ptr and idno in its content model Best wishes, Martina

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Next call: October 22
by Scholger, Martina (martina.scholger＠uni-graz.at) 18 Oct '18

18 Oct '18

Dear all, our next call is on Monday, October 22 from 09:00-10:30 EDT / 14-15:30 BST / 15-16:30 CEST. Please add your topics to the agenda: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1n_Zo-s-PQeMCKwJPmGYbs0F9CMD0VcQe4Vie_Yo… This is the hangouts link: https://hangouts.google.com/hangouts/_/brown.edu/teicouncil Best wishes, Martina Martina Scholger Zentrum für Informationsmodellierung Austrian Centre for Digital Humanities Universität Graz A-8010 Graz | Elisabethstraße 59/III +43 316 380 2291 martina.scholger(a)uni-graz.at<mailto:martina.semlak@uni-graz.at> http://informationsmodellierung.uni-graz.at<http://informationsmodellierung.uni-graz.at/> | http://gams.uni-graz.at<http://gams.uni-graz.at/> Chair of the TEI Technical Council | http://www.tei-c.org/ Institut für Dokumentologie und Editorik e.V. | https://www.i-d-e.de/

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Re: [Tei-council] thinking about oXygen
by James Cummings 15 Oct '18

15 Oct '18

Hi Peter, I guess that is a more reasoned approach. I'm not against it as a way forward, but if the money isn't too much (we don't know yet and how do we define 'much') and it helps a lot of people (again we don't really know, but certainly suspect it will), then it does seem reasonable. I'd be more concerned if it was taking a lot of time of council members. ;-) Many thanks, James -- Dr James Cummings, James.Cummings(a)newcastle.ac.uk School of English Literature, Language, and Linguistics, Newcastle University ________________________________ From: Peter Stadler <pstadler(a)mail.uni-paderborn.de> Sent: 12 October 2018 17:09:45 To: James Cummings Cc: Martin Holmes; Syd Bauman; TEI Council Subject: Re: [Tei-council] thinking about oXygen I’d like to see Alex’ response on how much it would cost and some estimation on how easy it would then be to maintain. I completely agree with Martin that the main motivation is to support older oXygen versions (which is common with our users, AFAIK). Finally, I think that money would be wisely spent, i.e. it shouldn’t be much but plenty of people will benefit (saying this without knowing any statistics …). Best Peter Am 12.10.2018 um 18:02 schrieb James Cummings <James.Cummings(a)newcastle.ac.uk<mailto:James.Cummings@newcastle.ac.uk>>: I'm increasingly of the opinion that our provision of the oxygen-tei framework is an optional extra and that it should just keep pace with the current version of the TEI and the current release of oXygen. If changes in oXygen mean that older version of it are no longer supported, so be it. I say that as someone who now doesn't have an institutional subscription to oXygen. I'm not saying that is the fairest or best decision for overall impact and outreach, but it might be the easiest in terms of managing our meagre time resources. Willing to be convinced to change my mind though. ;-) James -- Dr James Cummings, James.Cummings(a)newcastle.ac.uk<mailto:James.Cummings@newcastle.ac.uk> School of English Literature, Language, and Linguistics, Newcastle University ________________________________ From: Tei-council <tei-council-bounces(a)lists.tei-c.org<mailto:tei-council-bounces@lists.tei-c.org>> on behalf of Martin Holmes <mholmes(a)uvic.ca<mailto:mholmes@uvic.ca>> Sent: 12 October 2018 16:20:34 To: s.bauman(a)northeastern.edu<mailto:s.bauman@northeastern.edu>; TEI Council Subject: Re: [Tei-council] thinking about oXygen The ticket Alex raised has all the details: <https://github.com/TEIC/oxygen-tei/issues/27> I don't think I can explain it any better than that. My sense is that we're basically faced with: 1. Abandoning support for older versions of Oxygen in order to provide a fully-working interface with support for all the new features in the Oxygen interface in current versions. 2. Creating special tags for every version of Oxygen in which new features are introduced, and building a separate version of the plugin for each of those tags every time we build, with every build requiring the use of its own version of the oxygen.jar file. I don't like either of these options, frankly. #1 is bad because the only reason for maintaining the plugin at all is that people with older versions of Oxygen can keep their TEI and Stylesheets code up to date. #2 is a potential nightmare from the maintenance and bugfixing point of view. What happens if one particular version fails to build? Do we release all the other versions and not that one, or do we hold them all back till the bug is fixed? But the main problem is that we no longer have anyone with any expertise regarding the Oxygen plugin. A few years ago I taught myself enough about it to write a build file to create the various versions we currently maintain (the stable one, the bleeding-edge one, and the release one). I don't remember enough to feel confident about doing any of this work right now, and I don't have time to re-learn what I used to know (which probably wasn't enough anyway). Really, we need two or three people to take a deep dive into this and take responsibility for it. At the Council meeting, though, I think Magda was tasked with asking Alex if he would do the initial setup for us as a paid job. Cheers, Martin On 2018-10-11 09:29 AM, Syd Bauman wrote: > First, hope Michael didn't beat you up too badly, Sarah. > > Back in late Sep when we did a Stylesheets release we agreed to defer > a release of the oXygen plug-in for a bit. So we probably need to > have a discussion about what we are going to do. > > As a reminder, the results of this summer's survey on oXygen usage > is: > > | count majorVersion > | ----- ------------ > | 12 17 > | 6 18 > | 2 16 > | 2 14 > | 1 20 > | 1 15 > | 1 19 > > And of the 5 people using versions 16 or older, 2 or 3 of 'em hope we > continue to support the older version. > > Could Martin or James or someone else who understands this better > than I do kick off the discussion with a summary of the problem(s)? > _______________________________________________ Tei-council mailing list Tei-council(a)lists.tei-c.org<mailto:Tei-council@lists.tei-c.org> http://lists.lists.tei-c.org/mailman/listinfo/tei-council _______________________________________________ Tei-council mailing list Tei-council(a)lists.tei-c.org<mailto:Tei-council@lists.tei-c.org> http://lists.lists.tei-c.org/mailman/listinfo/tei-council

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Re: [Tei-council] thinking about oXygen
by James Cummings 12 Oct '18

12 Oct '18

I'm increasingly of the opinion that our provision of the oxygen-tei framework is an optional extra and that it should just keep pace with the current version of the TEI and the current release of oXygen. If changes in oXygen mean that older version of it are no longer supported, so be it. I say that as someone who now doesn't have an institutional subscription to oXygen. I'm not saying that is the fairest or best decision for overall impact and outreach, but it might be the easiest in terms of managing our meagre time resources. Willing to be convinced to change my mind though. ;-) James -- Dr James Cummings, James.Cummings(a)newcastle.ac.uk School of English Literature, Language, and Linguistics, Newcastle University ________________________________ From: Tei-council <tei-council-bounces(a)lists.tei-c.org> on behalf of Martin Holmes <mholmes(a)uvic.ca> Sent: 12 October 2018 16:20:34 To: s.bauman(a)northeastern.edu; TEI Council Subject: Re: [Tei-council] thinking about oXygen The ticket Alex raised has all the details: <https://github.com/TEIC/oxygen-tei/issues/27> I don't think I can explain it any better than that. My sense is that we're basically faced with: 1. Abandoning support for older versions of Oxygen in order to provide a fully-working interface with support for all the new features in the Oxygen interface in current versions. 2. Creating special tags for every version of Oxygen in which new features are introduced, and building a separate version of the plugin for each of those tags every time we build, with every build requiring the use of its own version of the oxygen.jar file. I don't like either of these options, frankly. #1 is bad because the only reason for maintaining the plugin at all is that people with older versions of Oxygen can keep their TEI and Stylesheets code up to date. #2 is a potential nightmare from the maintenance and bugfixing point of view. What happens if one particular version fails to build? Do we release all the other versions and not that one, or do we hold them all back till the bug is fixed? But the main problem is that we no longer have anyone with any expertise regarding the Oxygen plugin. A few years ago I taught myself enough about it to write a build file to create the various versions we currently maintain (the stable one, the bleeding-edge one, and the release one). I don't remember enough to feel confident about doing any of this work right now, and I don't have time to re-learn what I used to know (which probably wasn't enough anyway). Really, we need two or three people to take a deep dive into this and take responsibility for it. At the Council meeting, though, I think Magda was tasked with asking Alex if he would do the initial setup for us as a paid job. Cheers, Martin On 2018-10-11 09:29 AM, Syd Bauman wrote: > First, hope Michael didn't beat you up too badly, Sarah. > > Back in late Sep when we did a Stylesheets release we agreed to defer > a release of the oXygen plug-in for a bit. So we probably need to > have a discussion about what we are going to do. > > As a reminder, the results of this summer's survey on oXygen usage > is: > > | count majorVersion > | ----- ------------ > | 12 17 > | 6 18 > | 2 16 > | 2 14 > | 1 20 > | 1 15 > | 1 19 > > And of the 5 people using versions 16 or older, 2 or 3 of 'em hope we > continue to support the older version. > > Could Martin or James or someone else who understands this better > than I do kick off the discussion with a summary of the problem(s)? > _______________________________________________ Tei-council mailing list Tei-council(a)lists.tei-c.org http://lists.lists.tei-c.org/mailman/listinfo/tei-council

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thinking about oXygen
by Syd Bauman 12 Oct '18

12 Oct '18

First, hope Michael didn't beat you up too badly, Sarah. Back in late Sep when we did a Stylesheets release we agreed to defer a release of the oXygen plug-in for a bit. So we probably need to have a discussion about what we are going to do. As a reminder, the results of this summer's survey on oXygen usage is: | count majorVersion | ----- ------------ | 12 17 | 6 18 | 2 16 | 2 14 | 1 20 | 1 15 | 1 19 And of the 5 people using versions 16 or older, 2 or 3 of 'em hope we continue to support the older version. Could Martin or James or someone else who understands this better than I do kick off the discussion with a summary of the problem(s)?

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Next call: October 22
by Scholger, Martina (martina.scholger＠uni-graz.at) 12 Oct '18

12 Oct '18

Dear all, the best option for our next call is Monday, October 22 from 9:00-10:30 EDT, 14-15:30 BST, 15-16:30 CEST. This is the link to the agenda, please add your topics: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1n_Zo-s-PQeMCKwJPmGYbs0F9CMD0VcQe4Vie_Yo… Elli, please let me know if you can start the call. Best wishes, Martina

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